Ian Huntley

This is a bit like lighting the touch paper and running away but I really want to know where the consensus is on this one.

We as a society took the decision to rehabilitate him, that means to care for and help. We failed in that responsibilty if we allowed him to get his throat slashed didn't we? And you know what they always say, where there's blame there's a claim


Seriously though, I'm no fan of the man and I'd rather have seen worse happen to him for what he's done to those families but our entire justice system is undermined if we allow this sort of thing to go on isn't it?

P.S Munchkin, take a deep breath before replying to this one

i just did........i had some stuff on the go i was gonna post and thought better of it.........let me think........altough its gonna come out probably the same without the swearing....

I've got my moderator tools on stand by

predatory paedophiles like huntley are just that.......they hunt down kiddies and rape sodomise torture and usually kill their victims.....this to me is the very essence of anti-social.......when we ..(the law)...(which is over-run with lefty liberal wishy washy apologists)...get hold of them and guilt is beyond all question beyond any doubt.......we should display to them all the humanity that they showed their victims and remove them from this life,now im not saying kill the guy whos burglary went wrong and ended up with the victim being killed,i would say lock that person up for life on just basic food to keep him alive,provide him with a rope so if he/she so wishes can kill theirself to ease the burden on the taxpayer,society has to send a clear message that killings will not be tolerated.....in this country life sometimes means 6 years of cushty porridge,wow thats some deterrent isnt it,in the criminal fraternity sometimes you are not even accepted or trusted unless you have done some bird.....the law is made by politicians most of us have never heard of,thats wrong,we are a nation governed by people that have no clue about what goes on outside their walled and gated chauffeur driven worlds.....but im going off topic...sorry.....ian huntley......id hang him and get a voodoo shamen to put a curse on his bones that so wherever he may end up he feels the pain of holly and jessicas parents for all of eternity.

Vengeance is mine sayeth the lord, in other words god pays back debts without money. Why stain your conscience with his blood when you don't need to? He'll die sad and alone and probably very scared with of without help from us.

Problem with an absolute punishment is that there's no way back if you got it wrong, are you seriously telling me that the system wouldn't get abused? Over zealous cops forcing a confession, planting evidence etc. If someone is stitched up and then killed for it, how to you square that with the conscience of the society that put him there?

Sounds to me like you're looking for revenge, not justice.

im looking for retribution for those that ive said...BEYOND ANY QUESTION OF DOUBT......are guilty of the crime they are accused of.........huntley is beyond any question of doubt guilty of at least 2 kids murders......i dont want him studied i dont care what the reasons are why he done what he done i want him offed so that he will never again grace this earth in his vile form......he treated those kids like animals and snuffed them out and burnt their bodies.........no mercy for him from me....but it seems im in the minority......have this conversation with holly and jessicas parents and see how you get on..

I'm just playing devils advocate here Munch, be a crap conversation if just agreed on everything.

Consider this though, without the media constantly reminding us about him would we even remember his name after all this time?

holly and jessica's parents will always remember his name.......hes back in the spotlight cos hes goin for thousands of pounds of compo.......hes playing us.....no need if he was put down......

The TOAB is going to tear you a new asshole on this one

munchkin wrote:......get hold of them and guilt is beyond all question beyond any doubt.......we should display to them all the humanity that they showed their victims and remove them from this life

munchkin wrote:.....................society has to send a clear message that killings will not be tolerated.....

munchkin wrote:.....ian huntley......id hang him and get a voodoo shamen to put a curse on his bones that so wherever he may end up he feels the pain of holly and jessicas parents for all of eternity.

So we should kill those guilty of serious crimes to send a message that killing will not be tolerated??

Tell me, how do you condem a killer if you also are a killer??

oh well....im not the converting type.......i know what i know ....i put myself as a father in his victims parents shoes......if someone done that to my kids......i would not only be prepared to kill him....id be prepared to beat him to a pulp prior to death........and if people want to say im no better than him.....then i would say....i never murdered anybodys kid and i would never murder anybody that that didnt murder one of mine........i would say to them......that bastard made me like this.......just as his apologists say his life made him like that......he was abused blah blah blah.......so are countless others but they dont go around killing little kids ....f**k ian huntley......i hope he dies screaming in agony....probably in liver failure from all the rich food he recieves in his penthouse....sorry jail cell.....

munchkin wrote:........and if people want to say im no better than him.....then i would say....i never murdered anybodys kid and i would never murder anybody that that didnt murder one of mine........

He has parents too so you would be murdering someones kid......... Regardless of age your kids will always be your kids....... And on that note I guess it would be okay for his parents to come kill you afterwards? Where would it end? And as Ian Huntley has tried to take his own life on serveral occassions, something tells me he would welcome death.......

If you detest him as much as you say, why would you want to grant this mans wish of death?

NR_TOAB wrote:

munchkin wrote:......get hold of them and guilt is beyond all question beyond any doubt.......we should display to them all the humanity that they showed their victims and remove them from this life

munchkin wrote:.....................society has to send a clear message that killings will not be tolerated.....

munchkin wrote:.....ian huntley......id hang him and get a voodoo shamen to put a curse on his bones that so wherever he may end up he feels the pain of holly and jessicas parents for all of eternity.

So we should kill those guilty of serious crimes to send a message that killing will not be tolerated??

Tell me, how do you condem a killer if you also are a killer??

i thought i was being specific......i would hang (and if i had my way draw and quarter).....predatory paedophiles....whos sole aim is to kill our children......

Yes, but as a killer of the killer how are you any better than the killer?

NR_TOAB wrote:

munchkin wrote:........and if people want to say im no better than him.....then i would say....i never murdered anybodys kid and i would never murder anybody that that didnt murder one of mine........

He has parents too so you would be murdering someones kid......... Regardless of age your kids will always be your kids....... And on that note I guess it would be okay for his parents to come kill you afterwards? Where would it end? And as Ian Huntley has tried to take his own life on serveral occassions, something tells me he would welcome death.......

If you detest him as much as you say, why would you want to grant this mans wish of death?

easy......death granted......well i'll be sleeping well tonight........that just doesnt make sense......huntleys parents would try kill me for killing him.....if ian huntley was my kid i would wash my hands of him and be as disgusted as the general populace.........he who casts the first stone etc.

If disowning your child was as easy as that life would be much easier for parents........


But, by granting this wish you are releasing him from the pains of this world. And, if he's a religious person, repenting before death would grant him entrance to the kingdom of heaven. Lush paradise for his crimes....... Yeah, sounding like a better idea all the time......... Stop the killers in society by making a society of killers........

I have to say though, I totally understand Munchkins feelings on this one. Just thinking of those poor girls and what they must have been through makes me shudder. I know that when I think about it logically we shouldn't condemn violence with violence but you can't help that primal urge to seek vengeance. Maybe this conversation would be best placed trying to find the root of that feeling and understanding why we feel we have to protect or avenge those we've never met.

Aggression always comes from fear, so are we scared that this person could do it again or that they look and sound like we do? Is the fear that this could happen right on your doorstep and you'd done nothing to prevent it? Would beating and killing a guy you've never met prevent other people from doing the same as he did?

NR_TOAB wrote:Yes, but as a killer of the killer how are you any better than the killer?

i could live with it.......whos to say your stance wouldnt change if you had a kid that was abducted tortured and murdered god forbid.......as long as there are people like me...(minority) there will be people like you (majority)....arguing about it......killing a child killer will make me better than a child killer......im still a killer but i didnt kill a child geddit...

I understand Munchkins feelings, but there is no logic behind those feelings.. Just anger & vengeance......

If I had a child who was abducted & murdered by some paedophilic son (Or daughter) of a bitch I would want them to live a long time. I would want them to live in pain as I must, for at least as long as I live. I would want them to suffer & awake everyday remembering & regretting their crime, just like I would. Killing them might make me feel a little better, but knowing that they are in the depths of despair, suffering for their crimes & begging for the sweet release which death would bring would make me feel a whole lot better.........

Keep in mind that many killers kill themselves after killing their victim to escape the punishments of this world....

Killing a criminal is too easy & does nothing but creates a society of killers. How can you blame someone for killing another in retribution when that is exactly how the society in which they were raised deals with their problems. Maybe only the most serious of crimes would be punishable by death, but the definition of that alters depending on who you are asking.......

well im afraid we'll have to agree to differ,thank god i,ve never been in that position........and hope beyond hope i never will be.......but thats just it isnt it.....if huntley was serious about taking his own life he'd of done it by now......all his punishment is loss of being able to go down the shops and buy a pack of fags......his sentence is hardly a punishment in my mind.....hes watered and fed well and has access to tv, games and books to alleviate his boredom....he's got his own cell no doubt kitted out with obligatory x box and private toilet.......wow.....thats some punishment......and if he had a decent bone in his body he'd stop his briefs getting his name in the papers for what amounts to the occasional kicking ......my heart bleeds for the poor tortured soul it really does......how much compo did holly and jessicas parents get....?.....who knows what holly and jessica might of gone on to be ? a cancer curing scientist ?....... who knows but they were robbed of their right to life by a piece of filth who has never shown one spec of remorse and seems to revel in his notoriety.......id leave the scumbag a length of rope to get it over and done with.....but i fear we have a coward who will be laughing at his victims family for some time yet.

I knew we'd have to agree to disagree before I made my first post

He hasn't been able to take his own life because he hasn't been allowed to. He's on suicide watch which means he's regularly checked & can be quickly given medical attention. If it wasn't for that he would've succeeded a long time ago.

I'm not saying that the current jail terms are sufficient punishment. I'd prefer jails to be much harder & sentences to be longer, but what we have now is better than a death penalty. After all, we had that here before & it didn't deter killings. In fact, there are less murders now than there were when the death penalty was in place. Also, you only need to look across the pond (Pun intended ) to the USA where they still have the death penalty & still have a quite high murder rate..... Doesn't seem to deter killers over there either.

So, with the deterrent argument gone we are left with all there can be to support a death penalty. Anger & vengeance, both of which are morally unacceptable in modern society. If we're gonna go with what is morally acceptable in modern society then killing another as punishment shouldn't even be contemplated as the act itself & the reasoning behind it are both morally unacceptable.......

Him being in the papers all the time is not down to him. It's down to 2 things:
1) selling papers
2) Public interest

As for what Holly & Jessica could've been, well mybe they could've grown to be wonderful human beings. Maybe they would've grown to be crackheads. Maybe they would've gotten hit by a bus the very next day & never reached adulthood. We'll never know. But as for compo for their parents, that just wouldn't work. After all, it could be said that maybe Holly & Jessica's parents should've been watching their children a little more closely........... They'd be alive if their parents had been a little more careful.......

cant blame the parents mrT,alot of maybe ifs and buts,huntley,whiting and co are responsible for loads of kids im sure having over protective parents that dont let their kids out of their sight,i also knew aswell we were always going to agree to differ ...ive done this subject to death on other forums as im sure you have aswell....i see your point....but im afraid im not as forgiving a soul as youself concerning predatory paedophiles..i care not about the death sentence being a deterrent,prison should be that but it isnt either,im done now on this topic and thankyou for your fair point of view.....i will leave you with the last words of a predatory paedophile before execution......

Westley Allan Dodd....."i was once asked by somebody,i dont remember who,if there was any way sex offenders could be stopped.I said no.......I was wrong "...............straight from the horses mouth mrT

To what extent does the duty of care of the prison service to a prisoner stretch? Should it be more or less or the same as the level of care the State itself owes to a free man?

What I'm getting at is that if you have your throat slashed outside a bar on a Friday night do you sue the police service for not having an officer present at the precise location and time needed to prevent the injury? What if the officer had been there? What guarantee is there the injury still would not have taken place?

I can't see any difference in that scenario and Ian Huntleys. It's an impossible ask to expect the Prison service to protect every prisoner at every minute of every day. I think what needs to be examined is whether Huntley received the same level of care and protection as evry other prisoner, and, if so, IMO there's no case to answer.

That's what I'm starting to love about you Guapo, a fresh angle on the debate